Kelvin Cato available

[HornetsGM]

I have no problem with it being unlocked, my only concern was that it was going to get out of control; I didn't want anyone to do anything rash.
It seems to be under control though.

[RaptorsGM]

bods is doing a fine job as a commish...no complaints here....i also think that there is no harm done on mass PMs...but we have to respect the commish and the rest of the team in the league..some dont want to receive spam PMs...i think the way to solve this is to have a poll  for the rest of the league to vote on it...that's my opinion

I'm pretty sure we know the answer to that poll. People don't want Mass Pm's sent to them, so I won't do it anymore. That;s really not the argument at all anymore. The argument is about how Bods thinks I reacted to him and the PacersGM in unacceptable ways, and I think that Bods and the PacersGM reacted to me in unacceptable ways.

[NetsGM]

And how did I treat you unfairly?  Please, elaborate.  Look at your post to me, and my previous posts.  I made a decision that you didn't like.  That doesn't make it unfair.  When you tell PacersGM to fuck off, surely you don't expect for me to sit here quietly by.

As I said, had you not been such a good, longstanding GM, you would have been out of here at that moment, and deservedly so.

[RaptorsGM]

And how did I treat you unfairly?  Please, elaborate.  Look at your post to me, and my previous posts.  I made a decision that you didn't like.  That doesn't make it unfair.

I've said it before. You didn't explain anything whatsoever in your intial posts. You just said:

Alright, serioussly Raps, no more mass pm's.

Too which I replied that I recieved 3 times more responses after sending a mass pm, and how it really helped out my team in the past doing it that way. Right then and there, I should have stopped, without the "quitcher bitchin" part (which was directed at the other GM's much more than it was directed at you), and then you could have said your deal about the Spam thing, then this whole thing would have been over. So I'll say it first, my bad. It's my fault for letting the BullsGM, PacersGM and MagicGM get to me. That's what sparked this whole thing.

[HornetsGM]

so you poor boy only get two pms out of your trade talk  

I believe that this was unnecessarily condescending; however, the response to it was out of line.

[NetsGM]

Then you ask for an explanation if you don't like the one given.  I have no problems with that.  Then I would have showed you the amount of PM's I got complaining about it the last time you did the mass pm's.  I have no problems elaborating.  And you have every right to ask for it.  But that's not being treated unfairly.

PacersGM might have been SLIGHTLY condescending.  Or it may have been the language barrier.  But didn't deserve NEARLY the response it got.

[Keith]

I didn't mind the pm but if thats going to happen what is the point of this forum?  One pm every now and then doesn't concern me.  If I started to recieve a pm for every trade posted in the trade talk or if everybody just starts sending them out it would be a different story.

[NetsGM]

I didn't mind the pm but if thats going to happen what is the point of this forum?  One pm every now and then doesn't concern me.  If I started to recieve a pm for every trade posted in the trade talk or if everybody just starts sending them out it would be a different story.

That's the exact point.  It's a precedent.  If you allow one person to do it, then you can't get upset when everyone does it.

Can you imagine getting 30 PM's daily, all of them unsolicitated, and none of which relating directly to you?

[RaptorsGM]

And how did I treat you unfairly?  Please, elaborate.  Look at your post to me, and my previous posts.  I made a decision that you didn't like.  That doesn't make it unfair.  When you tell PacersGM to fuck off, surely you don't expect for me to sit here quietly by.

As I said, had you not been such a good, longstanding GM, you would have been out of here at that moment, and deservedly so.

Well, now, I wasn't able to respond to your entire post after you edited it. Yes, I understand your reasoning for jumping in after I told the PacersGM to fuck off. I DON'T expect you to sit back and do nothing. In fact, I DO EXPECT you to mediate over the situation immediatly. But to do that, you have to look at it from both sides. You and I were having a debate, and then the PacersGM jumped in and, what I feel, is that he mocked me. I feel that calling someone a "poor boy" for only recieving 2 PM's is clearly mocking them. I can imagine the face that someone would make while they said it, and it's a mocking face.

I don't think the PacersGM had a right to say what he said, since his post sounded like 1) he didn't read my comments, and 2) he had no idea about what he was talking about (since he said that half the GM's had made it clear that they weren't interested, and there is obviously no possible way for me to know that)

And I also don't think that I had a right to tell him to fuck off.

And I also don't think that you had a right to tell me to fuck off. If you want to talk about things that won't be tolerated, don't turn around and do them again. Lead by example, that's all I'm going to say.

Hopefully we now have this issue resloved. I aplogize to you, Bods, for reacting in the way that I did to you telling me that I can't send mass Pm's anymore. I hope that you can understand why I reacted that way from what I have said.

And I also apolgize to the PacersGM for telling him to fuck off (even though I did say "kindly" ) It was wrong of me to swear at him like that. What I SHOULD have done was to make it clear that I felt that he mocked me and I did not appreciate it.

[RaptorsGM]

so you poor boy only get two pms out of your trade talk  

I believe that this was unnecessarily condescending; however, the response to it was out of line.

I agree 100% with that.

I think that his comment was unnecessary.

And I think that my response was also unnecessary.

I should have taken more things into consideration before I responded the way I did (ie the language barrier).

And Bods, yes, from now on I will ask for an explanation.

Now, I've said I'm sorry, and maybe there are others that are also sorry, and maybe not. Whatever the case may be, I say let's close this case with the verdict that there will be no more mass PM's, and EVERYONE will treat others with respect, and attempt to truely know the FACTS and FACTORS before responding to anyone.

[NetsGM]

And I also don't think that you had a right to tell me to fuck off. If you want to talk about things that won't be tolerated, don't turn around and do them again. Lead by example, that's all I'm going to say.

I am not Ghandi.  I do not respond to attacks with pacifism.  I'm just not that big of a person.

The reason we can't have league members telling each other to fuck off is not because I'm trying to create a family atmosphere.  It's simply that if people are telling that to each other, it's going to create a hostile atmosphere.  It will piss each other off.  We can't have everyone down their throats.

At that point, I certainly wasn't worried about pissing you off.  

Would it have been better for me to reply without emotion?  Certainly.  But 10 times out of 10, that ain't happening.

[RaptorsGM]

All right, I understand that.

But you need to understand that I was almost in the same situation. I should have replied to the PacersGM without emotion, but I felt like I was just attacked, and well, you know the drill.

[HeatGM]

i think this issue is settled...i understand why the raps reacted and bods the same way...lets just get this over with...

==========THE END===========

[SonicsGM]

Just let Zydrunas make his way to Seattle please.

[KingsGM-old]

I don't see any reason for mentioning my name in this debate considering i'm pretty calm and cool for the very long time now and i can't even remember when i said someone to "fuck off" in any thread.